不会算账

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Knowing
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不会算账

Post by Knowing » 2006-07-20 16:35

最近有两件事使我深切的怀疑自己的素质。
首先是不知道为什么,狸狸同学觉得我鞋很多而脑子很进水的样子,甚至大胆提出了一串玻璃珠换三双鞋的不平等条约,我都不知道是怀疑她还是怀疑自己好,俩个人都是堂堂名牌大学计算机系本科毕业的,不管是看着不会算账,真的不会算账,还是装得不会算账,都说明大学生基本素质需要加强。当然笑嘻嘻又要说了,受过高等教育就不能低素质了么?不准歧视受过高等教育的同学。一定是狸狸同学记得我在大二的西方会计学选修课上只得了通过,觉得有机可乘.....其实那门课我学的很好,不过那个女老师只分通过与不通过,你上当了....

最近用来管帐的网站yodlee 推出开销分类报告功能,平时不记帐的我好奇地看了看自己的开销报告,一看之下非常震惊。首先开销和收入曲线几乎是重合的!就是说我居然是个月光族,完全不符合自己心目中,独立自主,庄敬自强,富有社会责任感.....高大的现代妇女形像。其次的发现除了房子,最大的三种开销是 ............

现款
餐馆
教育


当然,我也惊讶的发现,花在个人护理和衣服鞋子上的钱,微不足道,在彩色的大饼上是那么细小的一条,即使是鲜艳的紫色,也几乎可以忽略。也就是说,我绝不是一粒虚荣的空气脑袋,而是一位爱吃,爱学习,爱花现款的...困惑的想,什么呢?好像没什么现成的名词可形容. :shock: 再说了,我也没受什么教育啊? :f22: 终于按捺不住好奇,我决定仔细看看它都怎么给花销分类。
看帐真的很烦,没一会儿我就头晕脑涨,不知所以。关键是完全没个边际,数字进进出出,好像都满有道理的,就是放在一起没有意义。我努力回想大学二年纪的会计学选修课,只记得当时最大的感想就是:每节课费那么大劲,什么未知数都没算出来,就是换一种方法把两边弄平了,感觉上没有解决什么问题,向来功利性目的性很强,从小被数学老师教育出来的我,总是觉得作了无用功,非常不爽。老师看我们有气无力的样子,生气的教育我们说,会计里的学问大了去了,别以为这个是枯燥无趣的科目,根据各种法规,选择“弄平”的方法不一样的时候,数字被放在的类别不一样。同样一笔支出,有的算法里是可以抵税的开销,有的算法里是可以折旧的成本,有的算法里就只能算亏损掉了。甚至支出和收入的记帐的时间都有讲究,这涉及被计入哪个财政季度的问题 ... 我仍然有气无力的听着,心里嘲笑的想,这不是朝三暮四的故事么?一共那么几个栗子还不是桃子,吃了就得了,数来数去干什么....直到Enron 倒了台,看他们在电视上挨个表演无辜,president 推说不知道CEO 搞什么鬼, CEO 推说不知道CFO 怎么算的帐,CFO 推说帐都是审计公司安德信同意的,安德信没的可推倒闭了事,CFO 只好把脸一扭投奔光明作污点证人,CEO 就被逼疯了,在纽约的俱乐部里揪着陌生中年妇女上下摸索搜人家身,非说那是来跟踪他的FBI ,FBI 愤怒的说我没有那么闲; president 一直抗着抗着,闷到内伤,心肌梗塞死翘翘了,所以有压力还是应该释放,解决..扯回来啊,我终于意识到会计的创造性和艺术性,不是盖的...桃子到底是算早上还是算晚上,自己左手跟右手把桃子掉个个儿是算俩边用桃子买卖了桃子,还是算俩边互相用桃子抵押借了桃子,都要求CFO在法律的规范下大胆创新,相当于带着锁链跳舞。跳的不好被抓住了,后果很严重。 :uhh:
扯了半天enron 到底要说什么?我也有点糊涂了。嗯,大概是说,不管这个帐在账面上看着怎么有理有据,人的常识还是起作用的,有的不能变没,没的不能生有,铁一般的数字摆在面前,不符合感觉就是不对嘛,不能蒙人。明明月月有结余,虽然不多吧,隔三差五的还是能存上个定期折子,前几个礼拜看利息又涨了0.25%,还悔恨存的早了点,心疼了半天呢,怎么就变成月光族了呢?...一串玻璃珠子要换三双鞋,搭多少感情都有点不大对劲;你对玻璃珠子有感情,我对鞋也有感情哪;你的玻璃珠子是意大利来的,我的鞋也是意大利来的呀;....看来看去,终于弄明白了。原来花旗银行转帐出去的时候,他们给标上提款;ING 转帐进去的时候,给标上了转移。怪不的看上去赚多少花多少呢...解决了这个疑问,我在自己心目中的形象又高大了起来,恨不能自拍肩膀。再看下去,又越看越糊涂。花旗银行内部的俩个账号间转钱,它算成日常杂货开销,所以过去六个月里,花在杂货上面的钱,居然是负数。就是说,我从自己手里用买杂货的名义,白拿了好多钱。这可上算。不对,上什么算啊,吃亏的也是我自己。我开始抱著非把事情搞清楚的决心,一项一项把表错的种类改回来,标了不到十分钟就烦了,心想这是干吗呀,又没有花儿街等著看报告,算了。

抱著勤俭节约的美好愿望,还是看看大笔的钱都花到那里去了。尤其是教育,百思不得其解。把教育类的开销挑出来看了看,噢,这个笨软件。除了几堂兴趣课程学费是标对了,它把所有书店,杂志和学校组织的支出都标上了教育类。所以我在Amazon.com 买的电器,在威廉堡书店买的咖啡桌画册,给校友会捐的款,在诗歌杂志举办的扑克比赛上赌掉的钱,统统被冠以教育的美名...

标餐馆还标的挺准的,被标的都是餐馆,餐馆都被标了。

最后回答大家的疑问:现款都花到哪里去了。其实大家估的差不离,大城市现金用的很多。清洁女工,推拿师傅,做指甲做脸,叫出租车,日常喝咖啡买中饭叫外买,街角小贩摊上买水果,从家边上的肉铺奶酪铺海鲜铺子买食物,衣服干洗鞋子钉跟,一般相熟些的小生意人,即使不强制,也都希望顾客付现金。

结论:我的素质还是很高的。这个软件不会算账, 有待改进。
Last edited by Knowing on 2006-07-21 9:17, edited 13 times in total.
Nevertheless, she persisted.

putaopi
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Re: 不会算账(cont)

Post by putaopi » 2006-07-20 16:39

Knowing wrote: 现款
餐馆
教育
现款怎么算开销?拿出去的现款都买了什么了? :lol:

洛洛
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Post by 洛洛 » 2006-07-20 16:55

你受了什么教育啦?要是念了法学院也就难怪了。
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dropby
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Post by dropby » 2006-07-20 17:09

买书订报都算教育吧?

豪情
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Post by 豪情 » 2006-07-20 17:24

到底是扭腰. 没有车. CASH有一大块花在TAXI上了吧?
我也想看YODLEE怎么分.
Last edited by 豪情 on 2006-07-20 18:03, edited 2 times in total.

vivi
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Post by vivi » 2006-07-20 17:32

你没有退休基金放在一边儿么?那应该不全算开销吧?

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Post by DeBeers » 2006-07-20 18:08

小k受啥教育了?开销那么大 :lol:
钻石恒久远

dropby
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Post by dropby » 2006-07-20 18:30

豪情 wrote:到底是扭腰. 没有车. CASH有一大块花在TAXI上了吧?
还有清洁女工的工资, 门房及其全班人马的小费. :super:

豪情
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Post by 豪情 » 2006-07-20 18:30

开销和收入曲线几乎是重合的!
上面有人指出退休帐户不算开销我想一开始就没有算进收入里. 其次MORTGAGE里面付本金部分应该算储蓄.
所以小K不是月光族, 而是收支平衡, 独立自主,庄敬自强,富有社会责任感.....高大的现代妇女

豪情
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Post by 豪情 » 2006-07-20 18:33

dropby wrote:
豪情 wrote:到底是扭腰. 没有车. CASH有一大块花在TAXI上了吧?
还有清洁女工的工资, 门房及其全班人马的小费. :super:
小美你是暗示小K用偷税女工么? 非法移民? SO NEW YORK.

Elysees
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Post by Elysees » 2006-07-20 18:40

哈,狸狸真可爱~~~

dropby
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Post by dropby » 2006-07-20 18:43

豪情 wrote:
dropby wrote:
豪情 wrote:到底是扭腰. 没有车. CASH有一大块花在TAXI上了吧?
还有清洁女工的工资, 门房及其全班人马的小费. :super:
小美你是暗示小K用偷税女工么? 非法移民? SO NEW YORK.
写张支票也算现金吧? 清洁女工没有收信用卡的吧? :f21: 如果我是清洁女工, 肯定坚定收现金, 才不会交税呢. :-P

豪情
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Post by 豪情 » 2006-07-20 18:52

BANKRATE.COM上面有个计算器, 给个收入列出美国大众的平均分类开销.
我好奇地算了两次, 分类没啥, 个体差异.最大的惊奇是总数: 月节余严重负数.

dropby
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Post by dropby » 2006-07-20 19:12

美国和加拿大现在的家庭储蓄率都是负数啊. 所以你得到的那个结果很正常.

洛洛
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Post by 洛洛 » 2006-07-20 19:28

我记得小k说过她的清洁女工是有绿卡的。
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dropby
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Post by dropby » 2006-07-20 19:31

洛洛 wrote:我记得小k说过她的清洁女工是有绿卡的。
有绿卡和收现金逃税没啥关系啊. 加拿大的保母都有绿卡, 都只收现金.

vivi
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Post by vivi » 2006-07-20 19:54

我是把退休基金买到最大值,然后放500块SAVING理,不欠债(因为没房),其它就可以花光的人。

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Post by 狸狸 » 2006-07-20 20:34

洛洛 wrote:你受了什么教育啦?
我觉得楼主面临的主要问题是情感缺失,这不是教育能够解决的 :eyepatch:
本来是人类朴实美好的情谊,被你张口说来,就是交换啊 :gros_yeux_tristes: ,算帐啊 :headscratch: ,上当啊 :action077:
完全是弱肉强食、等价交换、庸俗的人生哲学 :sleeping:
她这个人,心灵不美 :twisted: ,真不放心三妮儿的教育。
Perhaps we grows very strong, stronger than Wraiths.
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Post by 笑嘻嘻 » 2006-07-20 21:28

小k您瞧瞧这一算账算出多少哲学思考来。您这些钱可真没白花啊。 :applaudit01:
昨夜灯光穿过雨水,落在这海的城市。
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tiffany
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Post by tiffany » 2006-07-20 21:28

1?我老依稀记得小k跟三妮儿4奴隶和奴隶主的关系,咋的现在流行由奴隶来教育奴隶主? :headscratch:
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Knowing
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Post by Knowing » 2006-07-20 21:46

什么哲学思考,这是经济学思考。 :headscratch: 当然到狸狸嘴里都是心灵问题。切,杂志社稿费发的慢了点,又不见她讲感情讲心灵了。
Nevertheless, she persisted.

豪情
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Post by 豪情 » 2006-07-20 21:57

教育呢? 怎么还没说到?
小K不是才看了某些公司的财报吧.
今天倒是听说了件类似的事, 某公司HIRING FREEZE啦. 大量的REC不让用. 为什么呢?说是最近HIRE超额. 他们不服气, 说这些都是找了好久好不容易才招来的. HR说, 不是这样的. 每个财政年度, 没招到的空缺通通没收. 今年招到的人, 超过了REVENUE增长百分比, 所以从现在起FREEZE啦. 所以这个朝三暮四, 到处都在用呢.

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Post by 狸狸 » 2006-07-20 22:26

Knowing wrote:切,杂志社稿费发的慢了点,又不见她讲感情讲心灵了。
我跟杂志社是散工跟资本家的关系,本来就没有感情的啊~

:cry:
Perhaps we grows very strong, stronger than Wraiths.
Lord Smeagol? Gollum the Great? The Gollum!
Eat fish every day, three times a day, fresh from the sea.

Knowing
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Post by Knowing » 2006-07-20 22:35

别哭了,你看,我偷偷加了链接,好奇的人们会给你贡献点击的。 :f59:

教育的事儿明天说。。
Nevertheless, she persisted.

pomo
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Post by pomo » 2006-07-20 23:05

我去贡献点击了。
小K对会计的理解简直就是我滴心声。会计弄乱了我的逻辑,刚开始学的时候,我经常无语问苍天:这到底是要干什么?
小K同学在质疑报表真实性的时候,居然非常专业滴、无师自通地采取了研究现金流和工作底稿的方法,我只好劝劳模同学打消和她算帐的念头,回头K同学一来二去、闪转腾挪、成本核算,害得玻璃珠子血本无归都不是不可能滴――谈高贵的友情比较安全点。

Jun
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Post by Jun » 2006-07-21 5:57

CEO 就被逼疯了,在纽约的俱乐部里揪着陌生中年妇女上下摸索搜人家身,非说那是来跟踪他的FBI ,FBI 愤怒的说我没有那么闲;
Who is that? I haven't heard...

I am skeptical. Could it be an attempt to get a ruling of "incompetent to stand trial"? 12 years of watching Law and Order...

Knowing
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Post by Knowing » 2006-07-21 7:28

You did not hear that? Jeff Skilling had a breakdown about 2 years ago somewhere in upper east side. According to police report, He was very drunk, accused the other people in the bar as wired FBI agent. To prove that he tried to search them, and got into a fight.
Given it happened 2 years ago, I don't thin it was an attempt of anything. He was just a bit nutty :spamafote:
He has always been a bit unstable. Have you heard of the infamous conference call incidence? Back in early 2001 before the whole thing melt down, he called a wallstreet analyst who questioned Enron's accounting practise "Asshole", in front of the whole wallstreet on the earning conference call.
Nevertheless, she persisted.

Jun
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Post by Jun » 2006-07-21 8:02

I thought calling anyone who disagrees with him an "asshole" is a requirement for climbing to the top executive position in an oil, tobacco, financial, media, xxx conglomerate or corporation. (Feel free to also insert the White House, Secretary of Defense, Vice President, Secretary of State, etc., etc.)


What a shame Ken Lay died before sentencing and all his convictions are erased. I wish the civil suits and criminal suits could take every penny from his wife, children, relatives, estate, everybody who benefited from his theft and robbery.

ruby
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Post by ruby » 2006-07-21 8:47

我以前一直用Microsoft Money,每月一整理查看,每次都吓一跳,细看每项都有理,没有乱花,加在一起就 :shock: 。现在比较鸵鸟,知道账单都按时付,支票不会跳票就好了。另外我常用信用卡年初出具上年支出细表,那才看得人 :let_me_die:

Knowing
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Post by Knowing » 2006-07-21 11:00

Jun wrote: What a shame Ken Lay died before sentencing and all his convictions are erased. I wish the civil suits and criminal suits could take every penny from his wife, children, relatives, estate, everybody who benefited from his theft and robbery.
Are the convictions erased? I don't think so.

I watched documentary <Enron, Smartedy Guy In the Room>. It was a decent documentary, although not particularly deep and insightful.

Ken Lay's role in the whole Enron fraud was interesting. He did not architect it. Jeff Skilling and a couple of others did. But Ken Lay definitely knew everything, and allowed improper behaviour, because Skilling made him money. Ironically, it was the accounting fraud that killed Enron. And Accounting fraud happened due to the pressure to make money. As the decision maker, he suffered from his own greed, and dragged down 7 billion investor money with him. And he probably sincerely thought he was the victim.

Jeff Skilling was a brillian guy. His vision of Enron might seem ricidious now, but it was actually revolutionary. He reinvented energy market, and Enron took the lead to become the market maker of a lot of energy instruments that were not liquid before. What went wrong was again, the greed. Being the first and biggest market maker, being the pioneer who got there before all the law makers, they did not have work ethic at all. They just took advantage of the customers as much as possible, because they could, and it was not against any written law. And when they did not make enough money, creative accounting became the quick way out. To keep up the amazing number, they went further and further on the road...

The CFO, the auditing firm AA, the lawyers and the wall street bankers, they also knew what they were doing. Again they were not doing anything that were against written law. But they definitely knew they were doing sth borderline wrong -- that was why the fee was so good.

The moral of the story, I don't know. Perhaps is ... Greed is healthy until it becomes unhealthy? Or , enjoy everything in moderation, including your own greed and brilliance? Or, just becuase greed and brilliance are natural, doesn't mean you should indulge yourself?
Last edited by Knowing on 2006-07-21 13:28, edited 1 time in total.
Nevertheless, she persisted.

Jun
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Post by Jun » 2006-07-21 11:30

Greed is like power; it corrupts faster than sulfuric acid on aluminum. An interesting theory about people like Lay and Skilling is that they lack conscience in the technical sense, as in psychopaths like serial killers.

tiffany
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Post by tiffany » 2006-07-21 11:52

人的常识还是起作用的,有的不能变没,没的不能生有
这个是真的!不记得啥时候看过一个啥节目,dell的总裁(?)讲成功企业经验,忍着笑说:别听新兴理论利润不重要那套,利润重要!
自由早晚乱余生

豪情
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Post by 豪情 » 2006-07-21 12:07

玩ACCOUNTING见效快呀, 几个文字游戏就省大量的税或者 狂增 PRO FORMA EARNING 从而股票狂涨. 现在高层的收入主要来字STOCK OPTION, 拿完走人好了.
小K要是发行个小K股票, 教育费用都可以打入R&D. 不过R&D好象不受待见.
现在ENRON倒了, 说LAY有责任因为他逼CEO不择手段挣钱, 花儿街没责任么? 很多分析家明知不太对头出于自身利益摇旗呐喊, 鼓励纵容ACCOUNTING花招. 个人投资者也有责任, 不读财报, 读了的不看重ORGANIC GROWTH, 虽然无罪, 赔了自己也不能都怪别人吧. 投机的就更该认赌服输.

森林的火焰
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Post by 森林的火焰 » 2006-07-21 12:22

ENRON案中,别人尤自可,最倒霉的是本公司的员工,发股票当退休金或福利的那种。一下子退休金都没有了,他们本来可是只想保本的。
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Knowing
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Post by Knowing » 2006-07-21 12:27

花儿街有责任啊,大了去了。enron 倒了,大家就告花儿街,美林等几个银行赔了不少钱。
分析师纵容这种大公司的确是利益驱使。提供投资建议的部门本身油水少,每年都从(Investment banking) 投资银行部分拿花红。Enron 这种大客户有什么发行债卷发行新股或者筹钱的生意,给哪个银行,全看他们乐意。银行上面的大头为了搞关系拉买卖,很听话的管着底下的分析师。一边是大棒一边是胡萝卜,你说分析师能不听话么?
Nevertheless, she persisted.

Knowing
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Post by Knowing » 2006-07-21 12:38

最倒霉的不是enron 的员工,是原来一些电力公司拿退休金的退休员工,和吃电力公司股票的老头老太。电力公司股票本来是铁饭碗,不涨也不跌,每年派利息,跟债券似的,是老人退休傍身的恩物。稀里糊涂的,电力公司被enron 收购了,旧股票被换成了新股票,新股票又突然变成了废纸....
Nevertheless, she persisted.

豪情
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Post by 豪情 » 2006-07-21 12:42

所以ENRON倒之前不是还给SNOW还是CHENEY打电话么? 想着这么大的影响政府也许肯出手相救, 结果没有回话. 还是那个量子基金狠.(也许人家有格老手机号码).
哪天FANNIE MAE或者FDMC倒了不知联邦救也不救?
Last edited by 豪情 on 2006-07-21 12:44, edited 1 time in total.

Jun
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Post by Jun » 2006-07-21 12:42

The system breeds all kinds of conflicts of interest and corruption, all thanks to the deregulation in the 80s. Hail free market economy! Hail greed-driven Capitalism! Hail Ronald Reagan the best president in US history!

Knowing
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Post by Knowing » 2006-07-21 12:54

豪情 wrote:所以ENRON倒之前不是还给SNOW还是CHENEY打电话么? 想着这么大的影响政府也许肯出手相救, 结果没有回话.
是啊,叫别的资本家看的心都凉了,白捐了那么多钱,关键时刻掉链子. :f22: 跟总统他爸混的烂熟也不管用,权捏在副总统手里。 :f22: :f22:

deregulation 本身不能说绝对是错的。但是在垄断性那么高的市场里,一deregulate 马上就等于任人宰割。能源市场到现在都是一团乱麻,法规特不健全。很多在股票市场上绝对算违法的操作,在能源市场上天天有人干。股票市场上的“中国长城”,在能源市场上就不存在。一个energy trader 跟我们说过:这边接到客户的电话要买什么,马上大声告诉边上自己公司的trader , 让他们赶紧买,把价钱抬一抬,再卖给自己的客户。
把加州搞破产的事情,下手还是太狠了点。借用The Rounder 里的名句:你可以从同一头羊身上剪很多次毛,但是只能剥一次皮。
Last edited by Knowing on 2006-07-21 13:01, edited 1 time in total.
Nevertheless, she persisted.

陆念
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Post by 陆念 » 2006-07-21 12:59

不知有本Enron的纪录片有没有人看过,还是很有趣的

Jun
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Post by Jun » 2006-07-21 13:26

Knowing wrote:
Jun wrote:
I watched documentary <Enron, Smarted Guy In the Room>. It was a decent documentary, although not particularly deep and insightful.
And BTW, it is true that Lay's convictions will be vacated automatically according to Texas law, because he is dead now and cannot go through the legal procedures for appeals post-sentencing.

Jun
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Post by Jun » 2006-07-21 13:32

Cheney has enough oil industry ties himself. Halliburton anyone? And the billion-dollar no-bid Pentagon contracts Halliburton got to supply US troops to Iraq (including $45 a pop sodas billed to taxpayers' money)? And all the close-door energy policy meetings he has had with his ex-business partners from all the oil company executives? He has so far refused to supply these meeting minutes to Congressional supoena (? or requests?). Gee, I wonder why.

森林的火焰
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Post by 森林的火焰 » 2006-07-21 15:22

Knowing wrote:最倒霉的不是enron 的员工,是原来一些电力公司拿退休金的退休员工,和吃电力公司股票的老头老太。电力公司股票本来是铁饭碗,不涨也不跌,每年派利息,跟债券似的,是老人退休傍身的恩物。稀里糊涂的,电力公司被enron 收购了,旧股票被换成了新股票,新股票又突然变成了废纸....
:worthy: 啊,我以为美国的电力公司就Enron一家呢。
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密斯张三
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Post by 密斯张三 » 2006-07-24 12:05

说到咖啡桌画册,这是刚看到的daily dose of imagery,请跟着我齐声赞叹new yooooork

I don't rob people
Image
park avenue, new york.

克里斯汀
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Post by 克里斯汀 » 2006-07-24 22:55

图片看不到哇.

幻儿
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Re: 不会算账

Post by 幻儿 » 2018-07-23 14:56

我开始看《The Smartest Guys in the Room》了!Enron案发的时候我啥也不懂,也没关注。现在住在德州,动不动就听见人提Enron,看上去几乎所有律师所都给他们干过不同的活儿,我就想了解一下,免得人家说话我听不懂。这一看真是大开眼界啊!Jeff Skilling太天才了! :worthy:

幻儿
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Re: 不会算账

Post by 幻儿 » 2019-02-26 14:02

ENRON前CEO Jeff Skilling 上周出狱了!在监狱里12年多,现在65了。
Knowing wrote:
2006-07-21 12:27
花儿街有责任啊,大了去了。enron 倒了,大家就告花儿街,美林等几个银行赔了不少钱。
美林也要没了。报道说Bank of America要把Merrill Lynch从名字里去掉了。
滚滚长江东逝水。。。

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